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Notes - Little Lark

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First, a bit of housekeeping on ages/names:

Wallace is around 23 in this fic. Madelyn's 20. The other key players are also in their (indeterminate) 20s. As for my naming scheme, y'all know I hate naming OCs and such, but I kept with a vaguely Roman-Britain/Celtish theme. Any other names that show up are from the game.

Cordelia -- a reference to Shakespeare's King Lear. (Kent and Cordelia, a duke and Lear's daughter respectively, are the only characters who remain loyal to Lear to the bitter end, even after Lear banishes them. Our Kent's mom has always been named Cordelia in my head for this reason. lol.)

Adrian -- a reference to Hadrian's Wall. Also, alliteration ftw!

Brandon -- pulled out of my ass. Well, somehow my brain jumped from William Wallace to Bran the Blessed, but this one's not so much an active ref. He just felt like a Bran, and it fit in my naming scheme.

I also switched back to the "Djute" spelling over "Jute", which I have preferred in the past. I still prefer "Jute" for various reasons, but not to the extent that I really care which one is used, so I figure I might as well just go with the fan translation on this one.

And now, three main things to point out about this fic:

1. People tend to have a very limited view of medieval women and their place in life; I was trying sort of to respond to that while not completely disregarding the limitations that *did* exist for them, and the general mindset of society. (The society that these women were born and raised in, and thus shared in the ideals of.)

That being said, I'm well aware that there are "anachronisms" regardless. Chalk it down to FE being not our world but a fantasy world -- with magic, and with at least two highly respected historical women, one of whom founded what is probably the major religion on the continent -- which does or *should* change the dynamics somewhat. Also, I'm admittedly lazy, so some of details I just threw in if I could make it sound more or less plausible. (potatoes -- which was mostly a nod to hooves EPIC depiction of Wallace XD, patronage of the arts, etc.) I mean, again, I have Lycia, especially eastern Lycia down mostly as early medieval, Roman-Britain-ish era, but there are definitely some world-building details I slipped in that are probably more accurate to later periods.

At any rate, mainly this is just to say, I don't really buy the spunky tomboy!Madelyn interpretation that I think is probably common. In a relative backwater canton like Lycia it's not unbelievable (see: Isadora, who is also a nobleman's daughter, though I wouldn't exactly call her tomboyish either), and in fact seems like a natural assumption to make, given Lyn's personality and well, the fact that Madelyn ran off to the plains. Nothing against it, I guess, but it's pretty cliched imo, and anyway it's more interesting I think to assume the opposite, and really make her a product of her society. It makes her ultimate decision far more difficult and complex. Instead I funneled off the tomboyish aspects to Cordelia, mostly because I like the idea that Kent's mom was crazy but mellowed out with age (also other factors, but won't go into them here). I was also setting up an obvious parallel there with the Cordy/Brandon relationship -- eloping probably did not in general lead to happily ever afters.

2. Sacaen/Lycian relations were modeled loosely on a mix of American Indian/colonist relations and Christian (Western Europe)/Saracen. (The Sacaens themselves are more Mongolian than anything though, as I've mentioned elsewhere.) I know very little about Roma, otherwise I'd say there's a bit of similar stigma attached to the Sacaens probably. Similarly to #1, I was writing from the viewpoint again that if you're born and raised in a society with a certain set of prejudices and standards, you're going to retain those same prejudices no matter how open-minded you might otherwise be. And often these prejudices will not be overt, but rather will manifest in very subtle ways -- not all of which will appear "negative" at first glance. Also, prejudice goes both ways.

More or less, I'm pretty cynical about Madelyn/Hassar and don't think it was quite the romantic episode everyone likes characterizing it as, though I have no doubt the two of them eventually fell genuinely in love. (We begin to see that happening towards the end of the fic, I think.) For one thing, I have a hard time figuring out what Hassar would be doing smack in the middle of Lycia anyway, not only for long enough to have become good friends with Wallace but also with enough freedom to interact with Madelyn on a regular basis and indeed, fall in love. Sure, Lycia and in particular Caelin probably has "looser" standards, allowing for more freedom of interaction -- hence the servants' relatively friendly relationship with Madelyn -- but I reeeally don't think Lord Hausen would have allowed his daughter to interact casually with just any guy off the streets, especially a Sacaen. (there is almost certainly an element of "savages stealing our women" involved wrt Sacaens and Lycians, though the truth is probably the opposite, i.e. probably more mixed marriages involve Sacaen women and Lycian men rather than the other way around.) Also, I could understand if Hassar were hanging out in Araphen or one of the other cantons closer to the border, but in Caelin of all places? Hmmm. (Guy in Santaruz is an exception -- we KNOW he's been wandering away from his clan, in order to prove himself. But Hassar's the chief of the Lorca, or at the very least the son of the chief!) Well, this is addressed in fic, obviously.

3. Lycian politics must be insane, if only for the sheer number of players involved. Military arms are probably a much larger factor than court intrigue in general (contrast Etruria). And aside from that, Lycia fascinates me because it strikes me really as the most heterogeneous of the various countries on Elibe. There are a variety of cultural influences at work, I think.

But, perhaps most relevantly to this fic, Lundgren has never really made much sense to me. According to primogeniture, Lundgren would in fact be the heir over Lyn in the order of succession. In most instances. Though actually the way inheritance is set up in Elibe frankly confuses me. Clearly we have something like equal primogeniture or actually something probably closer to agnatic-cognatic or cognatic primogeniture as oppposed to purely agnatic in place (see: both Lyn and Guinevere), but eh. To put it in plainer words, women *can* inherit -- i.e. females are not excluded entirely from the line of succession.

Bah, primogeniture is confusing period, though. This is a pretty decent rundown, though seriously lacking in sources. (see also: order of succession) Or see this book (published in 1895 by a British dude).

Lyn's case is simply weird in particular as she's not just female -- she's the daughter of a daughter. And the other thing that seems to be clear about Elibe is that, as a typical "medieval" setting, inheritance is traced through the male line. So if Lyn were a son, then yeah, she'd maybe have a stronger claim than Lundgren (by "quasi-salic inheritance", in which succession can go through the female line but only males can inherit still). And then there's also the whole deal regarding proximity of blood. And this is leaving out the fact that Lyn's father is Sacaen, and that Madelyn wouldn't have inherited if she had stayed and married Araphen in the first place. There are really a lot of factors at work here -- i.e. it's really not as clear cut as the game tries to make it. Lundgren actually has a pretty strong claim on the throne even without resorting to the whole "Lyn is an imposter spiel" (which is probably another factor in why he has so many supporters, disregarding the implied blackmail).

The only reasonable explanation I can think of is that Lundgren himself has no tenable heir. I mean, clearly he's old enough to be a grandfather, and yet the game treats him as having no heirs? (In the sense that, if not Lundgren, the throne should have gone to Lundgren's son, or daughter if he had no son, and from there on to his OWN grandchildren. The whole inheritance dispute realistically would NOT have ended with Lundgren's death. As long as the male line holds out, they'd have priority over Lyn. And whether or not she actually had the strongest claim she really really would not have had an easy time of it if she'd actually wanted the throne, as she wouldn't have had any political backing whatsoever, and only the slightest military backing!) And if he didn't have heirs -- then why the fuck did he want the throne so badly? If he'd been a younger man at the time he made his power grab, then that'd be totally understandable, but if you believe the game he's just been sitting around for YEARS waiting for his brother to conk out so he can enjoy a few years of rulership before he himself conks out... huh?

So no, Lundgren almost certainly has heirs of his own, but for some reason or other their claim is just as shaky as Lyn's. But before Lyn shows up, there are no other complications, so hey, he can rest easy, assured that the throne's going to go to them through him regardless, simply because they're the only options.

Anyway, this will be explored more in Wherever I May Find Her. I'm just setting up some issues beforehand here.


And re: other stuff, yes, I was intentionally drawing parallels between Wallace/Madelyn and Kent/Lyn (though they really don't quite map very well XD), and yes, Hassar speaks quite a bit, if only because I don't believe in ".... ..... ....." romances. :P

And if you can't put two and two together regarding exactly what Madelyn was planning, it's probably my fault, but damn it, I just wanted to get this fic over with already. So uh yeah. Sorry. Her motives are complicated and not at all straightforward.

Anyway, if I don't get around to responding to comments I'm sorryyyyyyyy but really tired. T_T

(This fic totally needs to go through a round of editing when I am considerably more sane. i.e. I FAIL)
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On June 22nd, 2009 04:34 am (UTC), hooves commented:
At any rate, Lyn says she doesn't want Caelin, but she wants to please her grandfather, and he probably wants her to have Caelin. It's a sad circle, isn't it, that Caelin's bloodline dies right there-- or rather, the last heir ends up leaving Caelin, anyway, and it's not like she or her children are going back to rule again.

Errr, continuing, though, I don't think Caelin would accept Lyn, anyway. In fact, I daresay that she would abdicate either 1.) Because the thought of ruling makes her want to run, 2.) Because she wants to marry Kent and be happy, 3.) Because she wants to go home, and/or 4.) Pressure from the people.

Honestly, I believe that Caelin would be happy enough with Lyn around... Perhaps not trusting of her, but not hating her. However, if they thought she'd be ruling? I think they'd throw a fit. I can't even imagine. I'm sure Araphen would protest in its little corner, too. Lyn's life might actually be at stake if she decided to try and rule Caelin, even for a short time.

(I have a 'fic about that, anyway, and I'm considering using it as a ...conclusion to my novelization, but I'm undecided.)

Of course, if Lyn abdicated immediately after Hausen's death, or disclaimed the throne beforehand, even, then Kent could play steward and the people would be happy to see her go. Of course, that doesn't make a lot of sense, unless the people are uneasy about their country suddenly going to Ostia (a military canton).

Blahblahblah. I'm so full of stupid ideas. But anyway, I think Lyn's claim to Caelin is very shaky, indeed. It wouldn't be if she were 100% Lycian, really (at least, not as shaky), but she's a "mongrel", knows nothing of politics or even of Lycia itself, is very rough around the edges, et cetera. I can't see the average Lycian citizen being even remotely happy about her being the heir and ruling over them... I could go on forever about the kinds of rumors that would no doubt circulate about her-- you know, like bringing in savages to eat and live among them...

Also, I wonder if Lycia would know about Lyn's tribe. I can't see her telling anyone. I can't even see her sitting down with her grandfather and telling him all of the gory details. (Of course, my opinion of the attack on her people is not the same as others... I firmly believe she saw and heard and could even have experienced some pretty terrible things.)

Either way, I know in my "Year between Lyn and Eliwood's Story" I want to put emphasis on how Lyn earns the trust of her people-- and how easily it's shattered again when she tells everyone Hausen is dead...before she suddenly leaves again, and is gone anywhere from a year to two years. (Yet another reason why I think Lyn would struggle terribly to lead Caelin in a good way...not due to lack of skill, as I think she would be a strong leader, and I tried to show her caring attitude, and how it might have won over some people in Her Men, but due to the fact that the trust of a nation is easily, easily broken.

(And in Her Men, though it's not stated, most of the trust of those knights would be due to Kent and Sain, who respect and love Lyn dearly. I'm sure the others would be able to see that.)

(Of course, I've also wondered how badly the knights of Caelin might speak of Lyn at first, when Kent is first Knight Commander. It would hurt him, no doubt, to hear people speak crudely/badly/dirtily of her, but men are men, and not all of them are like Kent or Sain. After the longer journey at her side, though, they'd no doubt think that Kent and/or Sain had spent some...quality time with her. I'm sure rumors would be started.)

I'll shut up now. ALSO I LOVE YOU. AND I'M SORRY FOR SPAMMING...sortasorryanyway.
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On June 22nd, 2009 10:59 pm (UTC), shimizu_hitomi replied:
Yeah, I kind of figure it's the natural life cycle of Lycian territories though. My theory is that Lycia was originally a united kingdom under Roland that then splintered into various cantons -- over the years there's probably a lot of new cantons splitting off, old cantons being absorbed into bigger ones, etc.

Perhaps not trusting of her, but not hating her. However, if they thought she'd be ruling? I think they'd throw a fit.

Yes. This. So much. It's one thing for her to be the long-lost granddaughter of Hausen from Sacae -- but another thing entirely for her to be that, AND rule over an entire canton that doesn't even consider her as one of them. Like you said, it'd maybe be fine if she were full-blooded Lycian, but as it is, people would go berserk!

unless the people are uneasy about their country suddenly going to Ostia

I think this may be the case. It's a matter of national identity, maybe. Caelin may be small, but the knights, if Kent/Sain/Wallace/etc. are the norm, seem pretty proud to be from Caelin. To the peasants it probably makes no difference who's in charge (well, depending on how widespread distrust of Sacaens is, it might be a different story when it comes to Lyn, but Ostian rule wouldn't be much different to them probably), but I'm sure that at least the knights and the nobility would be strongly against becoming just another part of Ostia.

So I think there might even be some people who, despite their dislike of Lyn, might actually prefer that she stayed. If she played by their rules, of course.

like bringing in savages to eat and live among them...

LOL. Yeah. I could totally see people going nuts over that. Especially if they don't realize that her people are wiped out (and even if they did, I don't think they'd make a distinction between the different tribes). Because I agree, I don't think Lyn would have told. That's... just not something you can easily tell anyone.

the fact that the trust of a nation is easily, easily broken

Ah, this is very, very true. I can't wait to see how you handle this. And yep, I bet Kent and Sain setting an example definitely helped a lot, as I'm sure their judgment was highly respected -- though perhaps not at first, and certainly not by everyone. Definitely there would be rumors no matter what...

<33333 I LOVE YOU TOO. XD So don't be sorry. :P *spams back at you*
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On June 24th, 2009 01:53 am (UTC), hooves replied:
Caelin may be small, but the knights, if Kent/Sain/Wallace/etc. are the norm, seem pretty proud to be from Caelin. To the peasants it probably makes no difference who's in charge (well, depending on how widespread distrust of Sacaens is, it might be a different story when it comes to Lyn, but Ostian rule wouldn't be much different to them probably), but I'm sure that at least the knights and the nobility would be strongly against becoming just another part of Ostia.

AWESOME. SO MUCH THIS. Also, I was going with this idea for Shades of Grey (the 'fic mentioned above). I was thinking that Caelin might want to rid themselves of her, without giving her a chance to leave any kind of will/notice or abdicate (because if she abdicates, she leaves it with someone, or in the hands of Ostia). Which is funny-- the only person she trusts with Caelin besides Eliwood and Hector is...Kent. :D

If she played by their rules, of course.

And we know Lyndis better than to assume that she would do that. I mean, if she didn't want to, she definitely wouldn't.

That's... just not something you can easily tell anyone.

As shown in-game, talking about it makes her cry; I'm sure she'd be too proud to want to do so in front of many people. It'd be hard enough to tell one, let alone many. (I wonder when she might have spoken about this to Kent. (Or Sain, or Florina.) Something in me tells me that she would want to protect Florina from the details, though. Since...you know, she's usually the one looking out for her friend, and never the other way around, really.)

Definitely there would be rumors no matter what...

Lots of rumors, I'm sure. Which is kind of sad, since Lyn's not a bad girl, really. I mean, she could be unintentionally careless or flirty without thinking or realizing the consequences and the rumors that would get started, but...I could see Kent and/or Sain and/or Wil and/or Florina and/or dammit Hausen/Reissmann straightening her out pretty damned quick. I can't imagine how hard that first year in Caelin must have been for her...but then to return after being away for another year? Yeah, it'd be like starting all over. I feel bad for her just thinking about it. Especially because, if you assume she'd have an A-support with Kent by that point, they'd hardly have time together with him reconstructing the military and her assuming all her new duties. Sob.
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On June 24th, 2009 07:37 pm (UTC), shimizu_hitomi replied:
I was thinking that Caelin might want to rid themselves of her

Oh! Now there's an interesting thought. Do you think they'd have someone in mind to replace her? (and if so, who?) I guess the obvious options would be Kent (ironically XD) and Chancellor Reissmann (thanks btw for pointing out the spelling!), though Reissmann might be too old to be a viable option. Ohhh, or is that what you were planning play with re: adoption?

Since...you know, she's usually the one looking out for her friend, and never the other way around, really.

This is true. I don't even know if she'd tell Sain -- Sain is so silly most of the time that she might not feel comfortable with it, no matter how much she trusts him... unless he happens to be in serious!mode for some reason. I can actually imagine her telling Kent and Sain at the same time if something serious happened that triggered it, maybe. (This is almost begging to be ficced. XD)

Yeah, it'd be like starting all over.

Oh man, yeah. Made doubly worse by the fact that Caelin was left in a huge mess thanks to Laus.
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On June 24th, 2009 09:58 pm (UTC), hooves replied:
Definitely re: adoption/finding someone to name as heir. Someone pretty high up in command in the military, too, I was thinking. Oh my gosh. I can just imagine them wanting to overthrow her to get Kent to take her place. That would be just sad. He'd be so angry. (Then he'd be glued to her side forever, and maybe even have to shotgun it out of there.)

Also, about Lyn's telling Sain. I agree with you, there. She might not even tell him, especially if he couldn't act like a mature adult-- one of the reasons I think she likes Kent is because of his maturity/ability to be serious. Though I think his lack of a sense of humor might bother her, there's no doubt in my mind that she'd manage to figure out things that made him happy! Either way, that is begging to be 'ficced, so I demand to see it! :D Errr... What do you suppose could trigger it, except perhaps being in the midst of a rather brutal attack?

Laus is pretty much why I said starting over again. :D I mean, Laus invaded, and even got hold of Hausen. Lyn LIED TO EVERYONE, said he was dead. Turns out he wasn't. So Lyn looks like the bad guy for leaving, and looks doubly the bad guy for lying. The people probably just wouldn't understand, and might not even believe her if she tried to explain. (Dude, you just abandoned your entire country, and you took military leaders with you!) <--Speaking of which, Kent and Sain leaving leaves a big hole in the military. They'd have to leave somebody in charge! (Got this covered, TOTALLY.) I'm also of the mindset (however incorrect or unplausible this is) that there could be more than one knight commander of Caelin, and that Kent is perhaps only ONE knight commander, rather than THE knight commander. (I kinda like this idea, as it makes their military bigger, gives Kent less men to worry about training, and gives a reason to have generals around.) <--But I might scrap that idea...maybe.

(I can't have a hard time imagining Kent suddenly training every knight in the damned castle. That's a lot to swallow, especially for someone who probably isn't good at talking, and isn't used to barking orders at anybody but Sain.)

Blargh. But yeah, Laus left Caelin with less men. Kent and Sain (Wil and Florina) grabbed Lyn and ran. (In my 'fic, I'd like them to QUITE LITERALLY drag her out of there. YAY KENT AND LYN YELLING AT EACH OTHER :D!) So two important military officers ran off with the heir to the throne. YEAH, THAT LOOKS REALLY GOOD to all those knights who were jailed/imprisoned and/or possibly killed. :| Not to mention the rest of the castle, the maids, et cetera, that didn't get away and were probably mistreated. |:

Also, re: Shades of Grey

It is evil. It's so evil, while writing notes for it, I CRIED. AT WORK. No, seriously. It's utterly depressing and JUST TERRIBLE, so I'd feel kind of bad writing it. The other option orbiting my head is for Lyn to find herself pregnant while still in Caelin-- before her grandfather's death, of course. Yeah, tough situation, that. Not sure I want to write that. XD!

(But Lyn being poisoned would be terrible, especially because after the failed attempt on Hausen, they'd know how to go about it and make it /really/ convincing. She'll totally think she's 'just sick' for too long. (And nobody else will know better, or realize what's going on for a while, considering 1) Lyn's stubborn and doesn't want to admit something's wrong, and 2) Everyone is *so concerned*.)

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